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WECLOME, ANNOUNCEMENT, NEWS & EVENTS => Events & Announcement => Topic started by: jack208 on September 19, 2007, 09:56:09 am

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on September 19, 2007, 09:56:09 am

For those of you drooling over getting a copy of the forthcoming Caylus Premium Edition from Ystari that costs EU65 just for the game alone, here's your chance to get a free set, courtesy of Ystari and Boardgamenews.








Caylus has been the darling of the Eurogame community since its debut, so much so that Ystari Games is releasing a Caylus Premium Limited Edition at Spiel 07 that comes with metal coins, a special figure of King Philip, and a completely redesigned look by superstar Mike Doyle.





Ystari Games is donating a copy of the Caylus Premium Edition, which retails for €65, for a contest on Boardgame News. To win the contest, you must determine the largest possible score that a player can obtain in a two-player game. To put everyone on the same ground, assume the following:


To give everyone an idea of what a winning score might be, I turned to the sourceof all things Caylus. “I had thought about the idea a while ago, but never did any serious research on it,” says Caylus designer William Attia, who speculates that the winning answer might be in the vicinity of 300.



While solo Caylus scores near 370 have been posted on the Geek, Attia says that in a two-player game, “You probably have to sacrifice quite a few points, especially in the beginning of the game, to allow the second player to get enough cash so that he won’t pass too early in the last two-thirds of the game (where most of the points are scored). Also, the second player might help rush up the building of the early castle sections to reach the most valuable favors earlier (while keeping the maximum number of game turns).”



To enter this contest, which has a deadline of September 25th, you must send an email to the BGN editor with your high score in the subject line along with the words “Caylus Contest.” In the body of the email, you must detail the steps you took to achieve that score. These details will be painstakingly checked by yours truly. If two individuals tie for the high score, the player whose opponent scored the most will win; this keeps you from tanking the other player too badly. If people are still tied, then the player who submitted his or her entry first will win.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on September 19, 2007, 01:03:00 pm
Anyone want to pakat on this?

I will get your vanilla Caylus while you keep the Premium set, deal?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on September 19, 2007, 01:56:56 pm
Mmmm...interesting. I've always wondered what the highest score achievable in 2er Caylus is.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on September 19, 2007, 02:09:13 pm

[quote user="rhyen"]Anyone want to pakat on this?
I will get your vanilla Caylus while you keep the Premium set, deal?
[/quote]



Too busy working out the game now to reply you..... [dreaming]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on September 20, 2007, 06:39:14 am
Urgh....hate number crunching contests. Unfortunately I lack the patience for analysis and also not pro enough in Caylus yet.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on September 20, 2007, 10:57:47 am

[quote user="wolfx"]Urgh....hate number crunching contests. Unfortunately I lack the patience for analysis and also not pro enough in Caylus yet.
[/quote]



Interestingly you do not have to be pro to win this contest. You just need to know Caylus good enuff and then able to logically step thru the moves. Full analysis paralysis allowed here at your leisure. [:P]



The key is "highest score" for one player, not highest combined score for a 2-p game. Hence the way a pro would play is to secure a win and probably trounced the noob. This won't secure the highest score for him. It'll secure a good winning score but not highest.



To get highest score, you need to be able to have the noob "help" you to get those scores, to set up the board and to manipulate the cubes/buildings. It's not "normal" Caylus.



It's about possibilities.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on September 20, 2007, 02:31:05 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

The key is "highest score" for one player, not highest combined score for a 2-p game. Hence the way a pro would play is to secure a win and probably trounced the noob. This won't secure the highest score for him. It'll secure a good winning score but not highest.



To get highest score, you need to be able to have the noob "help" you to get those scores, to set up the board and to manipulate the cubes/buildings. It's not "normal" Caylus.



It's about possibilities.

[/quote]

don't forget the tie-breaker where the "noob" has to have the highest score for you to win.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on September 29, 2007, 06:30:55 pm
Okay,

Hengy sent in his entry about 6 hours before the dateline closes. Congrats to our first, last and only submission from BGC, may you win the thing and donate the PLE set you are buying to me!!!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on September 30, 2007, 08:46:46 pm
not really sure about my calculations since no one spent the time to check my workings. but for those who were interested, the score was 409. so spread into the 18turns X 6 actions/turn, I scored approximately 3.78 points per action. Which is on the good side since a good action of putting on a goldmine will net you 3 points.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 11, 2007, 02:32:00 am
Been awhile since the contest ended and I emailed the boardgame editor about the result.

Seems like he encounter lots of difficulty in interpreting the results and selecting the winner! Missing information and errors in the steps detailing!

And my guess is, all the contest entries are equally as error-prone!

So, gggrrrr, if only bgc folks had spent time to check my calculations, we might have won outright!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 11, 2007, 02:42:25 am

Half expected that la.... after all since there's no official notation for Caylus, I was wondering how BGN will check the entries. Anyway you got me at a wrong time la.. when u sent your worksheet I was rushing a project report plus preparing for office shifting. [:(]



But you already getting your Caylus Premium set end of this month already wat.... so am I, hehe

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 11, 2007, 06:34:58 am

theoretically, the organiser just have to check the one with the highest score.... but i assume the highest score got problem, so he moved to 2nd highest, then also problem, then 3rd highest until i think now he give up already.



So he said he will arrange a proper time to dissect everybody's entry after Essen :(

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 11, 2007, 10:04:05 am
[quote user="jack208"]

But you already getting your Caylus Premium set end of this month already wat.... so am I, hehe



[/quote]



 



So which one of you gonna bring it to OTK to test drive? Hehehehe.



 

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 11, 2007, 01:56:07 pm
mine is a display set, dunno about jeff's. but if i win another set, i might use it for playing.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 11, 2007, 02:15:05 pm

[quote user="ayheng"]mine is a display set, dunno about jeff's. but if i win another set, i might use it for playing.[/quote]



B-b-but.....games are meant to be PLAYED. Its a sin to display and not play such a beauty. Its like shrink-wrapping your wife...... [:(]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 11, 2007, 09:57:24 pm

[quote user="ayheng"]mine is a display set, dunno about jeff's.[/quote]



hehehe... that's all I'm going to say. [:P]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 12, 2007, 09:00:26 am
[quote user="ayheng"]mine is a display set, dunno about jeff's. but if i win another set, i might use it for playing.[/quote]

easy, we take the games out of the box, set it up nicely in a display case, lock the display case and seal it and then lock it inside your house.
that is what you meant by display set, right, hengy?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 12, 2007, 11:17:00 am

[quote user="rhyen"]
easy, we take the games out of the box, set it up nicely in a display case, lock the display case and seal it and then lock it inside your house.
that is what you meant by display set, right, hengy?
[/quote]



well... since you asked so nicely... NNNOOO!!!!!



Display set as in still in shrinkwrap and it sits on my bookself to intro to other people the box art. In no circumstance is the box ever opened. EVAR.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 12, 2007, 02:44:48 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

Half expected that la.... after all since there's no official notation for Caylus, I was wondering how BGN will check the entries. Anyway you got me at a wrong time la.. when u sent your worksheet I was rushing a project report plus preparing for office shifting. [:(]



But you already getting your Caylus Premium set end of this month already wat.... so am I, hehe

[/quote]

maybe they should hold a competition for best Caylus annotation....
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 12, 2007, 03:48:41 pm
Lets see who can tahan longest not opening their Premium Sets.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 13, 2007, 05:52:51 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]Lets see who can tahan longest not opening their Premium Sets.
[/quote]

my money is on heng, rm20.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 13, 2007, 10:44:58 pm

[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Lets see who can tahan longest not opening their Premium Sets.
[/quote]

my money is on heng, rm20.
[/quote]



mebbe CE talking about himself la.



Heng: If u dun open the boxset, how to show ppl the artistic gameboard, tiles etc? And more importantly the cling cling sound of the coins?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 14, 2007, 04:55:09 am
[quote user="jack208"]

mebbe CE talking about himself la.



Heng: If u dun open the boxset, how to show ppl the artistic gameboard, tiles etc? And more importantly the cling cling sound of the coins?

[/quote]
 
I didn't order a premium set, lah. If I did, I will be opening it, but I didn't.[:P]

Guys, boardgames, whether premium or not, are meant to be played. BGs are not much use sitting on the shelf in shrinkwrap. After a while, it will get moudy inside due to lack of sunlight [hotsun] and then, whatever art inside will deteriorate. I have seen mouldy gameboard and gameboxes before. You know, those white fungus stuff...and the black ones, you DON'T want the black fugus on your board.

Hence you will not be able to appreciate the joy of looking at a truly beautiful board in all its mint glory if you don't open the game. You will get better return for your investment in terms of playing and appreciation if you open your boardgames and play, so rip that shrinkwrap open when u get the game and have a party around the gameboard. Have a Caylus Premium Edition Shrinkwrap-Ripping Party with pole dancers in lion suits. [+:o)][fiesta]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: shrapnel on October 14, 2007, 06:08:45 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]

Hence you will not be able to appreciate the joy of looking at a truly beautiful board in all its mint glory if you don't open the game.

[/quote]

Ah, this is not true...
You can always buy two premium sets. Open the other!!
Genius idea, no?[:D]

 [thumbsup][cheers][scarf]


Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 14, 2007, 12:34:24 pm
[quote user="shrapnel"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]

Hence you will not be able to appreciate the joy of looking at a truly beautiful board in all its mint glory if you don't open the game.

[/quote]

Ah, this is not true...
You can always buy two premium sets. Open the other!!
Genius idea, no?[:D]

 [thumbsup][cheers][scarf]


[/quote]

yeah! [ohyeah] (win the game win the game win the game, better win the game)
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 14, 2007, 02:48:38 pm
I agree with CE, ayheng. You should open your Caylus Premium before the black fungus got to it. hehehe
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 14, 2007, 05:20:52 pm
oh man, you guys scare me, guess i better open the shrinkwrap, throw some mothballs in and immediately re-shrinkwrap the box then...
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 14, 2007, 07:35:21 pm

[quote user="ayheng"]oh man, you guys scare me, guess i better open the shrinkwrap, throw some mothballs in and immediately re-shrinkwrap the box then...
[/quote]



Then the mothballs themselves grow fungus. They keep out moths but not the fungus? XD

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: shrapnel on October 15, 2007, 05:07:34 am
[quote user="wolfx"]

[quote user="ayheng"]oh man, you guys scare me, guess i better open the shrinkwrap, throw some mothballs in and immediately re-shrinkwrap the box then...
[/quote]



Then the mothballs themselves grow fungus. They keep out moths but not the fungus? XD

[/quote]

I saw on TV - fungus-farming is a very lucrative business. The returns? Can buy many more shrinkwrap premium games. Here's a google guide for you in case interested.

If you really wanna, you need to disinfect the contents (ultra-violet, etc),
vacuum shrinkwrap then store, prefer cold-storage. IF this advicio el no good, well... open and play!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 15, 2007, 10:12:08 am
[quote user="shrapnel"][quote user="wolfx"]

[quote user="ayheng"]oh man, you guys scare me, guess i better open the shrinkwrap, throw some mothballs in and immediately re-shrinkwrap the box then...
[/quote]



Then the mothballs themselves grow fungus. They keep out moths but not the fungus? XD



[/quote]

I saw on TV - fungus-farming is a very lucrative business. The returns? Can buy many more shrinkwrap premium games. Here's a google guide for you in case interested.

If you really wanna, you need to disinfect the contents (ultra-violet, etc),
vacuum shrinkwrap then store, prefer cold-storage. IF this advicio el no good, well... open and play!
[/quote]



Well you know what they say. "You gotta be a fun guy to avoid the fungi".



So open your Caylus Premiums, Jeff and ayheng. You both know you're fun. [;)]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 15, 2007, 11:56:26 am
[quote user="ayheng"]oh man, you guys scare me, guess i better open the shrinkwrap, throw some mothballs in and immediately re-shrinkwrap the box then...
[/quote]

resist the dark side, ayheng.
if the Sith wants to play the Caylus PLE, they have to buy the Caylus PLE.
do not give in to the dark side.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 15, 2007, 01:15:16 pm
The mothballs stink up the Caylus LE. After a while, even if you throw the mothballs away, the Caylus LE still stinks for a few years. No more value lah.

(Actually, mothballs fo not get rid of fungus, like what Shrapnel said, otherwise, they will be called fungusballs).

Anyway games collectors can tell whether the shrinkwrap is factory shrinkwrap or diy shrinkwrap, like car collectors could tell factory paint from repaints.

So, open your Caylus LE and have fun. [innocent]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 22, 2007, 04:24:43 pm
img_7631.JPG

Jeff, looks like we preordered the wrong game, we shud have got this one, CAYLUS 3D!!!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 24, 2007, 03:54:30 pm

[quote user="ayheng"]
Jeff, looks like we preordered the wrong game, we shud have got this one, CAYLUS 3D!!!
[/quote]



Ya la... after we ordered and paid, then only they show this pic... bugger! Anyway just saw this at BGG.... crazee [mad] Caylus PLE going for USD130 and I think that exclude shipping



http://boardgamegeek.com/geekstore.php3?action=viewitem&itemid=81984

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 25, 2007, 02:37:52 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="ayheng"]
Jeff, looks like we preordered the wrong game, we shud have got this one, CAYLUS 3D!!!
[/quote]



Ya la... after we ordered and paid, then only they show this pic... bugger! Anyway just saw this at BGG.... crazee [mad] Caylus PLE going for USD130 and I think that exclude shipping



http://boardgamegeek.com/geekstore.php3?action=viewitem&itemid=81984

[/quote]

how much for Caylus 3D?
at least, this game is worth displaying in a glass cabinet.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 25, 2007, 07:04:29 pm
With some wargamers here, one can comission the 3-D Caylus, no?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 25, 2007, 09:13:58 pm

[quote user="Champion Eternal"]With some wargamers here, one can comission the 3-D Caylus, no?
[/quote]



Ah... the Diorama guy who's 100% Iron! Yoo-hoo Shinobi.. u wanted here! [comehere]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 26, 2007, 06:21:59 am
Shinobi, looks like jack208 wants you to commission somefink...
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 26, 2007, 07:13:15 am

So when are u guys opening up your Caylus PLEs? When gonna have opening ceremony and have a play run?



[A]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 26, 2007, 07:21:05 am
[quote user="wolfx"]So when are u guys opening up your Caylus PLEs? When gonna have opening ceremony and have a play run?[/quote]

When I was just a little boy
Some one bought Caylus
And I like the game.



Will it be opened?
Will it be played?
Here's what they said to me



Que Sera Sera
Whatever will be, will be
The future's not us to see
Que Sera Sera
What will be, will be



[:-*] psst hengy, u know how to sing this song? Next time those dudes ask again, we sing this ya?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 26, 2007, 09:36:43 am
[quote user="jack208"][quote user="wolfx"]So when are u guys opening up your Caylus PLEs? When gonna have opening ceremony and have a play run?[/quote]

When I was just a little boy
Some one bought Caylus
And I like the game.



Will it be played?
Will it be good?
Here's what they said to me



Que Sera Sera
Whatever will be, will be
The future's not us to see
Que Sera Sera
What will be, will be



[:-*] psst hengy, u know how to sing this song? Next time those dudes ask again, we sing this ya?



[/quote]



 





When I was, a young boy
My uncle (Jeff), he took me into Essen,
To see Caylus Premium Ed.

He said son when, you grow up,
Will you be, the one to open up my Caylus,
together with everyone in BGC.

He said "Will you defeat them, your demons, and all the non believers, the ones who won't open it.
Because one day I leave you,
A phantom to lead you in the summer,
To join the Caylus Parade



*Symphony of Ochestra + Electric Guitars*

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 26, 2007, 09:38:05 am

nope, dunno wotcha tokking about there. These are not the Caylus Premium Edition you are looking for, move along...



[:-*]jack208, they're onto us, i say we feign ignorance

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 26, 2007, 09:55:50 am

[quote user="wolfx"]
He said son when, you grow up,
Will you be, the one to open up my Caylus,
together with everyone in BGC.[/quote]



Que Sera Sera....



[:-*] psst heng, I think we just tell them Edw forgot to collect our set. hehehe

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 26, 2007, 10:45:14 am
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="wolfx"]
He said son when, you grow up,
Will you be, the one to open up my Caylus,
together with everyone in BGC.[/quote]



Que Sera Sera....



[:-*] psst heng, I think we just tell them Edw forgot to collect our set. hehehe

[/quote]

if you two had any inkling of this, you guys wouldn't have advertised that you guy were buying the PLE in the first place, now you guys have to reap what you sow.

wolfx: you really really sing off key, even jack208 sounds like a choir boy next to you [:P]

everyone else, stop bugging them.


[:-*] psst heng, when can I come over to look at the box art?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 26, 2007, 10:46:31 am
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="Champion Eternal"]With some wargamers here, one can comission the 3-D Caylus, no?
[/quote]



Ah... the Diorama guy who's 100% Iron! Yoo-hoo Shinobi.. u wanted here! [comehere]

[/quote]

maybe you guys should post this request in the wargamers forum, I think he seldom post here.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 26, 2007, 11:23:16 am
Boardgames are meant to be opened and played. [:P]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 26, 2007, 12:01:54 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]Boardgames are meant to be opened and played. [:P]
[/quote]

sometimes, things are meant to collect dust so to show their age [:P]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 26, 2007, 12:27:57 pm

[quote user="rhyen"]

if you two had any inkling of this, you guys wouldn't have advertised that you guy were buying the PLE in the first place, now you guys have to reap what you sow.

wolfx: you really really sing off key, even jack208 sounds like a choir boy next to you [:P]

everyone else, stop bugging them.


[:-*] psst heng, when can I come over to look at the box art?
[/quote]



 



How did u conclude i sing off key. -___-;;



 

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 26, 2007, 12:32:55 pm
[quote user="wolfx"]

[quote user="rhyen"]

if you two had any inkling of this, you guys wouldn't have advertised that you guy were buying the PLE in the first place, now you guys have to reap what you sow.

wolfx: you really really sing off key, even jack208 sounds like a choir boy next to you [:P]

everyone else, stop bugging them.


[:-*] psst heng, when can I come over to look at the box art?
[/quote]





How did u conclude i sing off key. -___-;;



[/quote]

based on my imagination and your lyrics
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 26, 2007, 01:05:17 pm

[quote user="rhyen"]

based on my imagination and your lyrics
[/quote]



 



Conclusion: You have bad imagination. [:S]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 26, 2007, 01:22:17 pm
[quote user="wolfx"]

[quote user="rhyen"]

based on my imagination and your lyrics
[/quote]





 Conclusion: You have bad imagination. [:S]

[/quote]

Maybe, but we will never know until we bring you to a Karaoke session with Rob and the others, Robs has got a killer voice.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 26, 2007, 02:32:07 pm

[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="wolfx"]How did u conclude i sing off key. -___-;;[/quote]
based on my imagination and your lyrics
[/quote]



I think he based that on your amended lyrics which do not at all jive with the tune of Que Sera Sera, that's assuming u know the song.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 26, 2007, 03:54:34 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="wolfx"]How did u conclude i sing off key. -___-;;[/quote]
based on my imagination and your lyrics
[/quote]



I think he based that on your amended lyrics which do not at all jive with the tune of Que Sera Sera, that's assuming u know the song.



[/quote]



But its supposed to jive with "Black Parade" which is years ahead of Que Sera Sera thus appealing more to the general public and somehow that concludes that both of you should bring Caylus PLE next OTK session. Heheheh. [:p]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 26, 2007, 09:17:32 pm
[quote user="wolfx"][quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="wolfx"]How did u conclude i sing off key. -___-;;[/quote]
based on my imagination and your lyrics
[/quote]



I think he based that on your amended lyrics which do not at all jive with the tune of Que Sera Sera, that's assuming u know the song.



[/quote]



But its supposed to jive with "Black Parade" which is years ahead of Que Sera Sera thus appealing more to the general public and somehow that concludes that both of you should bring Caylus PLE next OTK session. Heheheh. [:p]

[/quote]

Ah...no wonder the lyrics souns familiar!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 29, 2007, 03:16:39 am
[quote user="ayheng"]nope, dunno wotcha tokking about there. These are not the Caylus Premium Edition you are looking for, move along...

[:-*]jack208, they're onto us, i say we feign ignorance[/quote]



hengy, i cannot tahan liao.. I wanna open my Caylus....



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



I mean, Caylus Vin de Pays de l'Aude [rotfl]
This is what we ordered from Essen rite, hengy? We got the Premium Edition bottle, year 2005 somemore, hehehe

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 29, 2007, 05:40:26 am

I don't mind drinking some caylus either. Open la. Barger.



[:p]



Some ppl too rich liow.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 29, 2007, 07:47:44 am
Vin de pays only, what. The Game is more expensive than the wine lah.
Cheapskate, leh.[bleer]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 29, 2007, 11:29:06 am

after questioning macedwin, i have found out that, he brought 6 copies of CAYLUS PREMIUM EDITION (C.P.E.) back! Looks like there is C.P.E owners walking among us.



Eliminating jack208 and myself, we still have 4 C.P.E. walkers. IS it CE, who is ordering it to resell it at higher price? Or is it rhyen, ordering because he gave up waiting for others to donate the game to him? Or is it friedricetheman, ordering to fulfill his hoarding desire? Or is it aanemesis, ordering to... er... for order's sake?



hhhmmm.... veli veli suspicious....

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 29, 2007, 12:02:14 pm
[quote user="ayheng"]

after questioning macedwin, i have found out that, he brought 6 copies of CAYLUS PREMIUM EDITION (C.P.E.) back! Looks like there is C.P.E owners walking among us.



Eliminating jack208 and myself, we still have 4 C.P.E. walkers. IS it CE, who is ordering it to resell it at higher price? Or is it rhyen, ordering because he gave up waiting for others to donate the game to him? Or is it friedricetheman, ordering to fulfill his hoarding desire? Or is it aanemesis, ordering to... er... for order's sake?



hhhmmm.... veli veli suspicious....

[/quote]

Today is a rainy day. The umbrellas are up. Look for the orange umbrella in the forest of raindrops.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 30, 2007, 11:02:04 am
[quote user="ayheng"]

after questioning macedwin, i have found out that, he brought 6 copies of CAYLUS PREMIUM EDITION (C.P.E.) back! Looks like there is C.P.E owners walking among us.



Eliminating jack208 and myself, we still have 4 C.P.E. walkers. IS it CE, who is ordering it to resell it at higher price? Or is it rhyen, ordering because he gave up waiting for others to donate the game to him? Or is it friedricetheman, ordering to fulfill his hoarding desire? Or is it aanemesis, ordering to... er... for order's sake?



hhhmmm.... veli veli suspicious....

[/quote]

Maybe it is for the quiet people who didn't mention they were going to buy the game at all......
I can tell that one of them is wolfx......who wants you guys to open your set before his
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 30, 2007, 11:20:48 am
dear friends, i have just realise that i made a very fundamental mistake in my caylus contest entry. so no more hope for caylus premium ed no#2....
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 30, 2007, 01:20:09 pm
Awwwww....sorry to hear that. I wuz hoping you could open your 2nd set of Caylus LE...
Of couse, if I had indeed placed an order for Caylus LE, I might open my set...
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 30, 2007, 01:38:41 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]Awwwww....sorry to hear that. I wuz hoping you could open your 2nd set of Caylus LE...
Of couse, if I had indeed placed an order for Caylus LE, I might open my set...
[/quote]

funny, what was the exchange of money going on in the background at Mage Cafe that day?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 30, 2007, 02:18:03 pm
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Awwwww....sorry to hear that. I wuz hoping you could open your 2nd set of Caylus LE...
Of couse, if I had indeed placed an order for Caylus LE, I might open my set...
[/quote]

funny, what was the exchange of money going on in the background at Mage Cafe that day?
[/quote]

My favorite chocolate bar was the Wispa, 

I wish Cadbury would bring it back.

I actually once made a pun out of it once. A friend was eating her Whispa and, being a soft, flaky chocolate, the Wispa crumbs fell all over the place. I said to her, 'Don't be careless with your Wispa. She laughed and laughed. ("Careless Whisper" playing then).

Also made a pun on BGG. Reproduced the lyrics of "Caylus Whisper" in its entirety.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 30, 2007, 02:19:25 pm
Note to admin: my picture of the Wispa chocolate bars has failed to appear in the above message. Please check. Ta.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 30, 2007, 02:52:02 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]Note to admin: my picture of the Wispa chocolate bars has failed to appear in the above message. Please check. Ta.
[/quote]

haiz, looks like I am no longer the master of double post,. follow up post; spam post; etc
datuk, you can now aim your arrows at CE because he has already surpassed me and I cannot keep up this marathon.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 30, 2007, 02:59:44 pm
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Note to admin: my picture of the Wispa chocolate bars has failed to appear in the above message. Please check. Ta.
[/quote]

haiz, looks like I am no longer the master of double post,. follow up post; spam post; etc
datuk, you can now aim your arrows at CE because he has already surpassed me and I cannot keep up this marathon.
[/quote]

Haha! Admin : feel free to delete my post about the picture of Wispa not appearing after you hav rectified the problem, in the interest of fairness in our little sport of comparing inverse car sizes.[:)]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on October 30, 2007, 03:23:19 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Note to admin: my picture of the Wispa chocolate bars has failed to appear in the above message. Please check. Ta.
[/quote]

haiz, looks like I am no longer the master of double post,. follow up post; spam post; etc
datuk, you can now aim your arrows at CE because he has already surpassed me and I cannot keep up this marathon.
[/quote]

Haha! Admin : feel free to delete my post about the picture of Wispa not appearing after you hav rectified the problem, in the interest of fairness in our little sport of comparing inverse car sizes.[:)]
[/quote]

too late, now that we have started replying to it, it can no longer be removed now that a thread has emerged from this exchange.
You will now stop posting for the next 30 days
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 30, 2007, 04:16:53 pm
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Note to admin: my picture of the Wispa chocolate bars has failed to appear in the above message. Please check. Ta.
[/quote]

haiz, looks like I am no longer the master of double post,. follow up post; spam post; etc
datuk, you can now aim your arrows at CE because he has already surpassed me and I cannot keep up this marathon.
[/quote]

Haha! Admin : feel free to delete my post about the picture of Wispa not appearing after you hav rectified the problem, in the interest of fairness in our little sport of comparing inverse car sizes.[:)]
[/quote]

too late, now that we have started replying to it, it can no longer be removed now that a thread has emerged from this exchange.
You will now stop posting for the next 30 days
[/quote]

Ah! I'm sure admin can delete my post. They can do everything. [;)]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 30, 2007, 05:15:57 pm

ayheng: what was your "fundamental" mistake?? In the logging sheet or in the game itself?



CE: rhyen is right that a post that has been replied cannot be deleted (due to integrity links etc (technical jargon)). But you r also right admin can do anything... for eg I can force-delete that post... what happens is that it'll clear the profile of the poster. So can?



p/s Oh... when a profile is clear, you still retain your username so no worry but your post count gets reset to zero. [:P]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 30, 2007, 05:38:17 pm

So silly...what for keep the "thread hierachy" for. This is forum ler, not newsgroup. Zzzz



 

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 30, 2007, 05:52:07 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

ayheng: what was your "fundamental" mistake?? In the logging sheet or in the game itself?

[/quote]

its in the game itself
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 30, 2007, 06:03:34 pm

[quote user="wolfx"]So silly...what for keep the "thread hierachy" for. This is forum ler, not newsgroup. Zzzz[/quote]



haha... my fren.. a forum and a newsgroup are essentially the same design, from both the technical design and database-structure perspective. It's only the usage that makes one call it a forum or newsgroup.



In fact, if u design a forum system without thread hierachy it meant you are not maintaining database integrity, one of the must-not-break rules of RDMS. But then a lot of PHP dudes are such undisciplined programmers.. in fact I won't call them programmers as they've not actually understood what "programming" is. They are actually "code writers" someone who put together a few programming codes.



This is the reason PHP systems break then when put under stress- or load-test as they lack the basic architecture to support those load. It's a bit like how our Boleh-land engineers built houses.... very fast, very cheap but undercut corners everywhere.... unlike EU where they need to conform to certain specifications/standards etc.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 30, 2007, 06:32:30 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="wolfx"]So silly...what for keep the "thread hierachy" for. This is forum ler, not newsgroup. Zzzz[/quote]



haha... my fren.. a forum and a newsgroup are essentially the same design, from both the technical design and database-structure perspective. It's only the usage that makes one call it a forum or newsgroup.



[/quote]



 



Buuu buuuu....wrong.



A forum can actually be hierachy based or chronologically based. But nowadays its all chronologically based.



Newsgroups were hierachy based because of Usenet. It kept track of threads and sub-threads and how 1 person replied to the other. This later became a problem as threads became more embedded upon one another as more people replied to another's post. Thus the posting in chronological order was introduced and proved more effective to other users as the web apps of internet forums were created. Threaded discussions in community forums might actually create stress on the database as it has to create more joins just to get to the "latest reply" of a thread especially when its spammed by certain forum members. Comparatively to a regular non-hierachy thread, it just goes to the last message posted with only 1 hop in the database. Imagine rhyen quoting every single person in a thread (which is what he is doing now) its actually creating sub threads for every single post he's making. To actually read his post and all future posts below it may cause unnecessary database overhead. (Maybe this is why the server is crashing lately?)



That said, a threaded discussion may only be applicable in tech forums and usenet but not in a community forum where some members tend to SPAM. *hint hint*



Newsgroup



Forum (there's a forum netiquette section about spamming and multiposting that some members should probably read =P )



 



Quote



In fact, if u design a forum system without thread hierachy it meant you are not maintaining database integrity, one of the must-not-break rules of RDMS. But then a lot of PHP dudes are such undisciplined programmers.. in fact I won't call them programmers as they've not actually understood what "programming" is. They are actually "code writers" someone who put together a few programming codes.



Hence lacking the flexibility of users to edit their posts as well as delete double/multiple posts which is needed. There is no need for "integrity". Again this is a case of simplicity and funtionality. It has nothing to do with PHP vs ASP programmers. ASP can do the same thing....just that this board isn't doing it.



Quote



This is the reason PHP systems break then when put under stress- or load-test as they lack the basic architecture to support those load. It's a bit like how our Boleh-land engineers built houses.... very fast, very cheap but undercut corners everywhere.... unlike EU where they need to conform to certain specifications/standards etc.





Lowyat.net which is Malaysia's largest community forum, uses invision powerboard, one of the most highly acclaimed commercial PHP boards in the market. These are the board statistics as of 10:28pm today.



Quote



1656 user(s) active in the past 15 minutes
Our members have made a total of 3,758,955 posts
We have 104,749 registered members



And it has yet to break down. Only time its down is during scheduled maintenance.



Compared to our BGC:



Quote


There are 1 guest(s) online. There are 2 of 317 member(s) online - wolfx, jack208


317 users have contributed to 7,647 threads and 9,374 posts.

In the past 24 hours, we have 0 new thread(s), 76 new post(s), and 0 new user(s).


 


And still it breaks down so often, about twice a week. I rest my case. [:p]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 30, 2007, 08:18:18 pm
[quote user="wolfx"]Buuu buuuu....wrong. A forum can actually be hierachy based or chronologically based. But nowadays its all chronologically based.

Newsgroups were hierachy based because of Usenet. It kept track of threads and sub-threads and how 1 person replied to the other. This later became a problem as threads became more embedded upon one another as more people replied to another's post. Thus the posting in chronological order was introduced and proved more effective to other users as the web apps of internet forums were created. [/quote]



Talking to you reminds me of talking to programmers who are just plain stubborn and dogmatic and cannot see anything beyond their tunnel vision. Not all are, though.



I said the design of both newsgroup and forum are essentially the same. I did not say Forum and Newsgroup are the same [duh]. Show me the underlying design of two world-class forum and newsgroup and if they are not essentially the same (ie with referential links being one common item) then I'll rest my case.



True, forums are usually flat and newsgroup are usually heirarchy but thats USAGE (or in IT-speak, "the application of a design") and not design. Have you ever design a forum or newsgroup? If not, arguing further is moot. And for clarity sake, I'm asking "have you designed", not "have you used"; the key word here is "design" vs "use".



Any database RDBMS that does not have links are not properly designed. Yes you can design a db without links but how do you maintain integrity? Do you even know Codd's 12 Laws of RDMS. If not, I might as well argue with the wall.



Again, show me a Tier-1 application (and pls dun quote me freebies like PHP forums) eg SAP, Axapta, Oracle Financials, Peoplesoft - that does not have referential integrity and I'll again rest my case.



[quote user="wolfx"]It has nothing to do with PHP vs ASP programmers. ASP can do the same thing....just that this board isn't doing it.[/quote]



Fact: If a programmer can enforce referential integrity and choose to do so, he's a discipline programmer.



Fact: If a programmer can enforce referential integrity but chooses not to do so, he's an indiscipline programmer.



[quote user="wolfx"]To actually read his post and all future posts below it may cause unnecessary database overhead. [/quote]



If an appl is stressed due to referential links, it is becoz the database engine is NOT GOOD enuff la. Do you ever see an Oracle or DB2 or MSSQL database stressed? No but do you also realise that all these Tier-1 db has referential integrity as one of their key features?



Which db will stress if you use too many links? Well, MS Access is one (and that's a Microsoft product in case you wanna argue I'm 100% pro-MS). Foxpro is another and obviously MySQL is the other.



Most PHP apps are built on MySQL and do you know the MySQL database itself does not even have referential integrity feature? It cannot even be called a "relational database". Even now, it's so-called support for RI is not fully RI.



Note: However MySQL now has an Enterprise Ed that comes with referential integrity.



[quote user="wolfx"]Hence lacking the flexibility of users to edit their posts as well as delete double/multiple posts which is needed.[/quote]



Again, programmer [arghh]. You jumped to a conclusion without even finding out the source of the problem. here you implied the problems above are due to stress caused by links. Goodness, doesn't ppl apply logical analytic thinking to flush out problems anymore?



The above problems could very well be caused by bugs ie badly-written programs; which is what it is (I think).



In fact, if u actually know how referential integrity is designed into a forum or newsgroup software, you wouldn't even have made that stmt. Becoz all a new post needs is to reference back its parent post and integrity is maintained.



To display the thread in flat or heirarchical structure then is merely the application sending a different query and formatting the look-n-feel differently. Your discourse on making 1 hop vs many hops, rhyen post linking everyone and creating subthreads is making me LMAO.



[quote user="wolfx"]There is no need for "integrity". Again this is a case of simplicity and funtionality. It has nothing to do with PHP vs ASP programmers. ASP can do the same thing....just that this board isn't doing it.[/quote]



If you can say there's no need for integrity, I can rest my case fully on the "indisciplined programmer" argument. I dare you, come with me to a programmers convention - does not have to be Microsoft, can be Java or C+ groups - and bring up your point of "no need for integrity" and see how you'll get savaged.



It's not a case for simplicity vs functionality. Integrity is not about simplicity. It's about... well, integrity. If adding referential integrity kills the app, then it's the database that's the problem. If you are using PHP database, I agree... perhaps you shud not have integrity links to avoid such problems but if your backend is any of the high-end dbs such as Oracle, MSSQL and DB2, you need not worry about integrity killing your apps.



If you actually understand how a db structures its integrity tables and its search algorithm, you'll then und why integrity never kills an app. Rather than applying a layman's view to understand referential integrity.



[quote user="wolfx"]Lowyat.net which is Malaysia's largest community forum, uses invision powerboard, one of the most highly acclaimed commercial PHP boards in the market. These are the board statistics as of 10:28pm today.



And it has yet to break down. Only time its down is during scheduled maintenance.[/quote]



Er.. what does this prove? Again pls apply some logical thinking to your argument instead of emotional lashing. Are you trying to prove Powerboard is better designed than CommunityServer or are you saying Powerboard is more stable than CommunityServer?



The only thing I think your stmt above (Powerboard vs CommunityServer) proves is that Powerboard is a very matured and stable forum software and can support large number of users. While CommunityServer is a new, growing and yet-to-be-stable community software that encompass a forum, a gallery, a file, skinning, blog that still contains many bugs that make it perform less than satisfactory.



So CommunityServer breaks down more than Powerboard. Yes unfortunately it does. If you are resting your case becoz you think Powerboard is much more stable than CommunityServer, then yes you may do so coz even I agree with you. But that's like saying we shud be using a bicycle instead of a car, coz a bicycle is so much more stable than a car. Have you ever seen bicycle breaking down btw?



Er, your point again?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 31, 2007, 06:55:05 am

[quote user="jack208"]



Talking to you reminds me of talking to programmers who are just plain stubborn and dogmatic and cannot see anything beyond their tunnel vision. Not all are, though.



[/quote]



So much for objective and constructive criticsm. [co] I like the smell of napalm in the morning. [arghh][pain]



Well since you started it, you're the one who seems to be talking alot about integrity and throwing out technical jargon, you seem to be the old programmers who don't wanna change with the times, stuck in the old days of database design.



Quote



I said the design of both newsgroup and forum are essentially the same. I did not say Forum and Newsgroup are the same [duh]. Show me the underlying design of two world-class forum and newsgroup and if they are not essentially the same (ie with referential links being one common item) then I'll rest my case.





Define same. They are in no way same, not even at the database level. And by that I don't mean referential database VS non-referential database. Please read the wiki links i provided.



Quote



True, forums are usually flat and newsgroup are usually heirarchy but thats USAGE (or in IT-speak, "the application of a design") and not design. Have you ever design a forum or newsgroup? If not, arguing further is moot. And for clarity sake, I'm asking "have you designed", not "have you used"; the key word here is "design" vs "use".





I have set up PHP boards as well as ASP boards. So yes I have designed them before, but only at a very high level. These days forum applications are so easy to install that you don't even need to go into the gritty of it.



Quote



Any database RDBMS that does not have links are not properly designed. Yes you can design a db without links but how do you maintain integrity? Do you even know Codd's 12 Laws of RDMS. If not, I might as well argue with the wall.





I think you are confused with the point of my argument.



I did not say that a database should not have links nor should it have not have integrity at all. That would be silly to state and even impossible by today's standards as all data is referential one way or other even if you don't want it to. What I was arguing about was this board's redundant use of a hierachy based posting system. You stated that this is necessary to keep the post integrity. My argument was "What for have post integrity? Its redundant since we have the almighty quote box, and it introduces problems stated by CE about deleting/editing posts". I think your argument has went out of scope.



Quote



Again, show me a Tier-1 application (and pls dun quote me freebies like PHP forums) eg SAP, Axapta, Oracle Financials, Peoplesoft - that does not have referential integrity and I'll again rest my case.





Doh....i deal with enterprise solutions like SAP, JDE and Siebel. I'm  not a n00b. And as I said, your argument is out of scope.



Quote



Fact: If a programmer can enforce referential integrity and choose to do so, he's a discipline programmer.



Fact: If a programmer can enforce referential integrity but chooses not to do so, he's an indiscipline programmer.





Hmmm ok sure. Why don't I enforce referential integrity for every letter you type, it ties back to a word spelling algorithm unique to each user so that for every word you type, I know you are the one who typed it because it directly relates to you and how you spell the word. So by the end of the day, I know who in a forum spells "tomato" like "tomatoe" or "tamato". I can enforce mah? No problem rite? So should I just do it? 



Just think of the stupid overhead it will cause to the database just to implement this pointless referencing. Every word you type in a post will be related back to the poster. So silly. So many table jumps and transaction table entries will be created just to track something not fundamentally important. Sure I can do it. But what for? Integrity? This is integrity to the max mah rite? 



Thus this is what I meant at simplicity of design and usability. So back to my point, there's no point to enforce a hierachical posting system just for the sole sake of integrity in a forum. I didn't say there shouldn't be a relational database behind this forum. Sheesh. [arghh]



Quote



If an appl is stressed due to referential links, it is becoz the database engine is NOT GOOD enuff la. Do you ever see an Oracle or DB2 or MSSQL database stressed? No but do you also realise that all these Tier-1 db has referential integrity as one of their key features?





So are you trying to say Oracle, DB2 and MSSQL database will never be stressed? What if I told you I have? And why so you ask?  Because some programmer was too smart storing redundant transaction tables that could grow up till almost a million records a day, with nested references to god knows how many other related records. We fixed the problem by removing the silly redundant process. When we were done with it, only a thousand of records on the transaction table were created.



That said, a programmer must always think of the volume of data and the records that will be created. Then with the data, how many hops must a user make to get to the data he wants. The lesser the better.



Quote
 



Which db will stress if you use too many links? Well, MS Access is one (and that's a Microsoft product in case you wanna argue I'm 100% pro-MS). Foxpro is another and obviously MySQL is the other.



Most PHP apps are built on MySQL and do you know the MySQL database itself does not even have referential integrity feature? It cannot even be called a "relational database". Even now, it's so-called support for RI is not fully RI.



Note: However MySQL now has an Enterprise Ed that comes with referential integrity.





I think from my experience, no database is full proof. A database should not have too many hops for a user to get to a piece of data, that's the fundamental rule to database design. It all depends on alot of factors like data volume, no. of hops, as well as query code.



Quote



Again, programmer [arghh]. You jumped to a conclusion without even finding out the source of the problem. here you implied the problems above are due to stress caused by links. Goodness, doesn't ppl apply logical analytic thinking to flush out problems anymore?





I never said that the multiple posts and undeletetable posts to be the ones causing stress. Read what i quote and what I replied. I mentioned the multiple posts and undeletetable posts because I wanted to point out that its this hierarchy based posting that's causing this, and its redundant.



 It would be logical to conclude though that the hierachy based posting might cause un-needed stress on the system. Let me illustrate with an example.



OTK Gaming Thread +



Jeff: Who's onz for OTK Gaming? +



                                                     | Henry: Me! +



                                                                         | Heng: Me too!! +



                                                                                                    | Ken: Me three!! +



On the example above, due to people replying to the latest post, me as the 3rd poster would have to go through 3 inner joins just to reach the latest message which is by Ken. Of course 3 innerjoins is inconsequential to the database. But imagine a big thread like the real OTK thread with multiple posts and replies. Can you draw the hierachy of that thread in a graphical format? I think not. Just to get to the "November 2nd Subang SS15 gaming" part, I probably have to get through 1000++ innerjoins just to get there and it will continue to grow exponentially!



In contrast, flat posting system is based on time, so it looks like this.



OTK Gaming Thread +



Jeff: Who's onz for OTK Gaming? +



Henry: Me! +



Heng: Me too!! +



Ken: Me three!! +



And how many hops do I have to make to get to the latest post? 1. And 1 million posts later, how many hops do I have to make to get to the "November 2nd Subang SS15 gaming" post? Just 1, which is from the main post, "OTK Gaming Thread". So logically which do you think causes more overhead to the system?



Bear in mind I didn't say this WILL cause stress to the database. Its just a logical conclusion.



Quote



The above problems could very well be caused by bugs ie badly-written programs; which is what it is (I think).



In fact, if u actually know how referential integrity is designed into a forum or newsgroup software, you wouldn't even have made that stmt. Becoz all a new post needs is to reference back its parent post and integrity is maintained.





Hence the overhead. What if all posts only need to reference the 1st post? Edit, delete, etc. No problem.



Quote



To display the thread in flat or heirarchical structure then is merely the application sending a different query and formatting the look-n-feel differently. Your discourse on making 1 hop vs many hops, rhyen post linking everyone and creating subthreads is making me LMAO.





Refer to my above example. How can you present the data in the 1s diagram if hirachical posting is not enabled? The way the data is stored is also different. Its not about different query and look-and-feel. Because if it truly is look and feel, then why can't I delete my posts that I have made before? Because there are child posts under it right? That in itself tells you even the DB structure is different. LMAO back at yourself.



Quote



If you can say there's no need for integrity, I can rest my case fully on the "indisciplined programmer" argument. I dare you, come with me to a programmers convention - does not have to be Microsoft, can be Java or C+ groups - and bring up your point of "no need for integrity" and see how you'll get savaged.



It's not a case for simplicity vs functionality. Integrity is not about simplicity. It's about... well, integrity. If adding referential integrity kills the app, then it's the database that's the problem. If you are using PHP database, I agree... perhaps you shud not have integrity links to avoid such problems but if your backend is any of the high-end dbs such as Oracle, MSSQL and DB2, you need not worry about integrity killing your apps.





Refer to my above example of referencing how every user in a forum spells a word. There's no such thing as a DB that will not crash.



Its not about discipline or not. Its about functionality. Do you call a kungfu master who sleeps whole day meditating about Nirvana disciplined? Oh sure. But what are the other kungfu masters doing? Fighting the evil overlord to bring peace on earth. Which one is more functional, might I ask you?



If you wanna call people of the world stupid and only you as smart, then you can't see how google is so successful with their secret search algorithms or how they can provide you 5 gigs free email. Do you think they have physically enough hard disk space to store all the emails of its gmail users? Think again.



I think right now you're just stubbornly defending your community board despite real world examples everywhere. In fact I provided you links to examples but all you can spout is marketing "Perfect World Scenario" crap.



Quote



If you actually understand how a db structures its integrity tables and its search algorithm, you'll then und why integrity never kills an app. Rather than applying a layman's view to understand referential integrity.





I may not understand it like a professor, but through experience and studies, I know enough that integrity adds overhead to a database. Its a matter of making the right judgement on what integrity needs to be kept (like do you need to keep the integrity of how each person spells a word?) and what shouldn't.



Quote



Er.. what does this prove? Again pls apply some logical thinking to your argument instead of emotional lashing. Are you trying to prove Powerboard is better designed than CommunityServer or are you saying Powerboard is more stable than CommunityServer?



The only thing I think your stmt above (Powerboard vs CommunityServer) proves is that Powerboard is a very matured and stable forum software and can support large number of users. While CommunityServer is a new, growing and yet-to-be-stable community software that encompass a forum, a gallery, a file, skinning, blog that still contains many bugs that make it perform less than satisfactory.





My point was to counter your point that PHP boards are unstable compared to ASP boards. I proved to you a board that is PHP based and very much stable and has more user volume than BGC, which is ASP based and crashes alot despite very small number of users. That's all.



Quote



So CommunityServer breaks down more than Powerboard. Yes unfortunately it does. If you are resting your case becoz you think Powerboard is much more stable than CommunityServer, then yes you may do so coz even I agree with you. But that's like saying we shud be using a bicycle instead of a car, coz a bicycle is so much more stable than a car. Have you ever seen bicycle breaking down btw?





So you wanna fall back to "Community Server is a space shuttle flying to penang, when you can use Air Asia instead "analogy? Then I have nothing to say. Redundancy is the key word here, another basic database rule, to reduce data redundancy.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 31, 2007, 07:16:08 am
[quote user="wolfx"]It would be logical to conclude though that the hierachy based posting might cause un-needed stress on the system. Let me illustrate with an example.

OTK Gaming Thread +



Jeff: Who's onz for OTK Gaming? +



                                                     | Henry: Me! +



                                                                         | Heng: Me too!! +



                                                                                                    | Ken: Me three!! +



On the example above, due to people replying to the latest post, me as the 3rd poster would have to go through 3 inner joins just to reach the latest message which is by Ken. Of course 3 innerjoins is inconsequential to the database. But imagine a big thread like the real OTK thread with multiple posts and replies. Can you draw the hierachy of that thread in a graphical format? I think not. Just to get to the "November 2nd Subang SS15 gaming" part, I probably have to get through 1000++ innerjoins just to get there and it will continue to grow exponentially!



In contrast, flat posting system is based on time, so it looks like this.



OTK Gaming Thread +



Jeff: Who's onz for OTK Gaming? +



Henry: Me! +



Heng: Me too!! +



Ken: Me three!! +



And how many hops do I have to make to get to the latest post? 1. And 1 million posts later, how many hops do I have to make to get to the "November 2nd Subang SS15 gaming" post? Just 1, which is from the main post, "OTK Gaming Thread". So logically which do you think causes more overhead to the system?[/quote]



If this is THE example you can give, then there's no point to discuss further coz it's plain obvious programming (and I mean actual programming not some script writing with ERP apps) is not something you do.



Concepts of encapsulation, inheritance and data-persentation independence will all be lost on you.



If the design of your hierarchy forum (ie the first one) requires a poster to do 3 hops in order to reach your message.. then my dear fren, the problem lies in the programming technique itself and not in the language or database.



In my book, both examples both need ONLY one hop (and not even an inner-join, do you even know what's an innerjoin?) to reply, to delete, to edit, and to display. That's a database issue.



However whether the programmer chooses to display it as a flat or heirarchy forum is a presentation issue. What I'm saying is the same database structure can support BOTH types of forums and the same query will fetch both results (regardless of whether it's 3 posts or 1,000 posts deep).



However a different presentation code is needed to present it in a) hierarchy structure (ie your newsgroup), and b) flat structure (ie your forum).



Show me how your design requires THREE INNER JOINS to pick up the 3rd post in the 1st example and how your design requires ONE INNER JOIN to pick up the same post in the 2nd example??!! And I'll show you a SINGLE DESIGN that caters for both, a design that complies with Codd's 12 Rules (if you dunno the rules, just say dunno... dun say the rules are old-school).

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 31, 2007, 08:10:28 am
[quote user="jack208"]If this is THE example you can give, then there's no point to discuss further coz it's plain obvious programming (and I mean actual programming not some script writing with ERP apps) is not something you do.

Concepts of encapsulation, inheritance and data-persentation independence will all be lost on you.



[/quote]



If your board is created with an object oriented programming code and can handle encapsulation and inheritance in the 1s place, then maybe you have a point. But sadly its not. So your point is shot down. If the forum is using ASP.net or JAVA then its a whole different ball game, but then again, people always complain that they are both slow like hell. I experienced Java 1st hand and I don't like it one bit.



Quote



If the design of your hierarchy forum (ie the first one) requires a poster to do 3 hops in order to reach your message.. then my dear fren, the problem lies in the programming technique itself and not in the language or database.



In my book, both examples both need ONLY one hop (and not even an inner-join, do you even know what's an innerjoin?) to reply, to delete, to edit, and to display. That's a database issue.





Dude. To show the posts, the ASP application has to query the database to retrieve the data for the posts. Based on my example above, to do said query, I will have to query the foreign key of 3 different posts to get to the related latest post, hence the INNERJOINS. Do you even know how your forum works?



I am assuming that the program is perfect....so we're totally talking database now.



Quote



However whether the programmer chooses to display it as a flat or heirarchy forum is a presentation issue. What I'm saying is the same database structure can support BOTH types of forums and the same query will fetch both results (regardless of whether it's 3 posts or 1,000 posts deep).



However a different presentation code is needed to present it in a) hierarchy structure (ie your newsgroup), and b) flat structure (ie your forum).





If its purely presentation, why can't i delete posts that have been replied to? This should not be a problem if its merely a presentation issue. Its definately something underlying in the data structure.



Quote



Show me how your design requires THREE INNER JOINS to pick up the 3rd post in the 1st example and how your design requires ONE INNER JOIN to pick up the same post in the 2nd example??!! And I'll show you a SINGLE DESIGN that caters for both, a design that complies with Codd's 12 Rules (if you dunno the rules, just say dunno... dun say the rules are old-school).





I frankly never study Codd's in uni but wiki-ed it and its basically the same old stuff I already read. Show you design? How to show you? You show me yours 1st ler. Your board is not even OOP (Object Oriented Programming, not Out Of Production) and you wanna throw OOP concepts at me. Piiii la you.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on October 31, 2007, 09:00:14 am

[rotfl] When you make too many assumptions, you make an a.s.s. out of you and me.



1. The Community Server system is designed as a pure OOP application and written on the ASP.Net using C#. In fact, it incorporates many forward-looking design patterns as the developer/founder was formerly one of the key members of Microsoft's ASP.Net team (I think he was the team lead in some modules).



2. Java is slow only becoz the programmers who were working on Enterprise Java are indiscipline and did not have the proper foundation on programming, in particular OO concepts (prob some ex-PHP dudes). The same applies for ASP.Net.



In short, if you let me drive the Ferrari FI car, I'll still end up last in a race. Becoz the Ferrari FI car is slow? Nope, becoz I'm simply a lousy Formula One driver.



However done properly both Java and ASP.Net have no performance issues, and in fact highly scalable. Again, Microsoft lovers are usu. anti-Java but here I'm defending Java simply to correct a very wrong misconcept. Both Java and ASP.Net are strong programming foundation and I'll say one is not better than the other. If you want to find fault with MS here, it would be that they actually "copied" the concept from Java and did not invent something new, unlike Sun whom actually did a lot of groundbreaking work in coming out with Java. So credit where credit is due.



btw Java and ASP.Net are the two prominent development platform in the new school of programming. PHP is ugh... like well, as you said, "old school".



3. You are assuming the program is perfect, and the problem is the database? Dude, you have not even installed or implemented this application before, and neither have you maintained this application before... you have not even seen its database schema or its object classes nor any of its program codes. Yet you can make such inferences. Brilliant! [clapclap]



4. You did not study Codd but you simply wiki-ed it and then make assumptions about Codd and claimed it's old stuff? Oh... [clapclap] [clapclap]



5. Without even looking at the underlying code, but just from using the application you can know whether my board is OOP or not?!! Wah... even those programming gurus cannot do this wor.. you must be very kheng! [bowgod]



Note: Anyone who knows their ASP/ASP.Net stuff would know from the URL where it calls an "aspx" page that this is ASP.Net program (and not ASP). However even knowing it is written on ASP.Net does not automatically imply it is OOP or otherwise. You'll still have to look at the application architecture before you can say for sure.



[quote user="wolfx"]Dude. To show the posts, the ASP application has to query the database to retrieve the data for the posts. Based on my example above, to do said query, I will have to query the foreign key of 3 different posts to get to the related latest post, hence the INNERJOINS. Do you even know how your forum works?[/quote]



Oh.. I dun know actually how my forum works but you do? wow! [bowgod]



I'll still be waiting to see how your design needs to query foreign key of 3 different posts just to get the related latest post. That's most interesting thing I wanna learn from you. Or you can of course just cite "How to show you design?" and run away from it. [:p]



[quote user="wolfx"]If its purely presentation, why can't i delete posts that have been replied to? This should not be a problem if its merely a presentation issue. Its definately something underlying in the data structure.[/quote]



I'll answer in my "design" post later why you cannot delete your post. It's a functional issue. And how do you link it to presentation vs database, I've no idea. It's just the way CommunityServer implemented it vs say other forum apps.



[quote user="wolfx"]Show you design? How to show you? You show me yours 1st ler. [/quote]



Of course I'll show you mine (in a separate Show Me Your Design post). I dun simply open my mouth and then cannot back up or support my own words.



[quote user="wolfx"]Your board is not even OOP (Object Oriented Programming, not Out Of Production) and you wanna throw OOP concepts at me. [/quote]



Did you also just wiki-ed OOP ar? [:P]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on October 31, 2007, 11:13:54 am
To the rest of the guys: INCOMING!
Ooooops! Too late!
And I didn't even had time to put my flame-proof undies on.[hotsun]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on October 31, 2007, 11:24:20 am

i sense some post... [hijacked] [offtopic] !!!



dudes, get your techno-geek speak to non-gaming kopitiam discussion. Here is supposed to be my wallowing in self pity discussion about my script mistake [:(] [8o|] [headsmoke] [headcurse] [yinyang]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on October 31, 2007, 11:37:21 am

zzzz.



Forum died again at 1:30pm until now, 3:15pm.



Quote



3. You are assuming the program is perfect, and the problem is the database? Dude, you have not even installed or implemented this application before, and neither have you maintained this application before... you have not even seen its database schema or its object classes nor any of its program codes. Yet you can make such inferences. Brilliant! Clap Clap [clapclap]



4. You did not study Codd but you simply wiki-ed it and then make assumptions about Codd and claimed it's old stuff? Oh...





Uhhh.... the issue isn't the problem of it crashing. The issue is the hierachy-based posting that I was complaining about. You are the one who blew it out of proportion and made me comment on information that only you can provide.



When did I say Codd was old stuff? When huh? Please put it in quotes.



Quote



5. Without even looking at the underlying code, but just from using the application you can know whether my board is OOP or not?!! Wah... even those programming gurus cannot do this wor.. you must be very kheng! Bow to God [bowgod]



Note: Anyone who knows their ASP/ASP.Net stuff would know from the URL where it calls an "aspx" page that this is ASP.Net program (and not ASP). However even knowing it is written on ASP.Net does not automatically imply it is OOP or otherwise. You'll still have to look at the application architecture before you can say for sure.





I everytime said your website using ASP but you never correct me by saying ASP.NET, and you also always refer to your site is programmed with ASP, so i assumed so la. ASP is not OOP ma. So I know its not OOP loh. Your information not correct.



And no I didn't know about aspx. My job and clients never relies on MS stuff. Ever. So i will never have hands on experience on .NET architecture.



Quote



Of course I'll show you mine (in a separate Show Me Your Design post). I dun simply open my mouth and then cannot back up or support my own words.





Will be interesting to see how you reference the latest post with just 1 hop. I can always learn tips from sith lord. [darklord]



==============================================================



Well...anyway, the server crashed....AGAIN. [:p]



Admin loubeh? Coding loubeh? Architecture loubeh? Programming language loubeh? All of the above? Dunnola.



 



 



 

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: LoStBoYz on October 31, 2007, 04:55:19 pm
I LUV techno babble. Turns me ON baby!!!

Btw, the forum never crashes this bad before. It only started recently. I've used all kinds of forum, since I'm a self proclaim troll, I've never seen forum crash as bad as this, other than hardware failures incidents. You sure its not some bad sectors in your RAM that's screwing with you?

Cannot delete post is a weird phenomena that I've seen quite some time already and I noticed that right after you post, you cannot delete, BUT somehow you can delete it later. Whether its a bug or bad scripting, not too sure, me not coder.


Just for my knowledge, you still need to code forums? I thought the features already there in the package, you just need to script to get the look and feel you want. Call me ignorant if you want!

FIGHT ON!!!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: shrapnel on November 01, 2007, 07:33:10 am
Summary. I need summary.
I feel like I'm in the series 'Lost : Season 19. Ep 72' - [tagline "I know how you got lost in the last few forums".]

So ...mmm who's getting the most VPs here... Jack-O-lantern or Werewolfx?


Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: macedwin on November 01, 2007, 08:16:56 am
wah, drive ferrari still can come last... no wonder fly aeroplane never arrive lor ;-)
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: macedwin on November 01, 2007, 08:18:24 am
err, just so you all know, this thread is a promo/teaser for the forthcoming launch of flame of war game in malaysia... seriously!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 01, 2007, 01:51:39 pm
[quote user="macedwin"]err, just so you all know, this thread is a promo/teaser for the forthcoming launch of flame of war game in malaysia... seriously![/quote]

Started the FoW post in the Miniature games section oridi - more visibility that way.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Shinobi on November 01, 2007, 02:01:05 pm

[quote user="macedwin"]err, just so you all know, this thread is a promo/teaser for the forthcoming launch of flame of war game in malaysia... seriously![/quote]



Errrr........ FOW has been here for ages already, with quite a number of players playing regularly [;)]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 01, 2007, 02:31:07 pm
How many players are playing, Shinobi?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Shinobi on November 01, 2007, 02:51:31 pm
See the other thread....... can't remember the exact number
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 01, 2007, 07:28:37 pm

[quote user="Shinobi"]See the other thread....... can't remember the exact number[/quote]



Ya, see other thread (click here). Leave this for our techno pow-wow ayheng self-wallowing corner.



edited: btw where's the self-wallowing, hengy? Or mebbe we shud run another contest for BGC members to SPOT the error you made? If correct, you give them your Caylus PLE?? [:P]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 01, 2007, 07:50:38 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="Shinobi"]See the other thread....... can't remember the exact number[/quote]



Ya, see other thread (click here). Leave this for our techno pow-wow ayheng self-wallowing corner.



edited: btw where's the self-wallowing, hengy? Or mebbe we shud run another contest for BGC members to SPOT the error you made? If correct, you give them your Caylus PLE?? [:P]

[/quote]

Jack208 - your post reminded me of what the LE in Caylus LE is  for.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 10:51:40 am
[quote user="jack208"]

CE: rhyen is right that a post that has been replied cannot be deleted (due to integrity links etc (technical jargon)). But you r also right admin can do anything... for eg I can force-delete that post... what happens is that it'll clear the profile of the poster. So can?



p/s Oh... when a profile is clear, you still retain your username so no worry but your post count gets reset to zero. [:P]

[/quote]

OOOOhhhh.......must take care not to offend the Jedi Council in the future at all......
So powerful the Jedi Council is.[machinegun]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 10:55:23 am
[quote user="wolfx"]

Buuu buuuu....wrong.



A forum can actually be hierachy based or chronologically based. But nowadays its all chronologically based.



Newsgroups were hierachy based because of Usenet. It kept track of threads and sub-threads and how 1 person replied to the other. This later became a problem as threads became more embedded upon one another as more people replied to another's post. Thus the posting in chronological order was introduced and proved more effective to other users as the web apps of internet forums were created. Threaded discussions in community forums might actually create stress on the database as it has to create more joins just to get to the "latest reply" of a thread especially when its spammed by certain forum members. Comparatively to a regular non-hierachy thread, it just goes to the last message posted with only 1 hop in the database. Imagine rhyen quoting every single person in a thread (which is what he is doing now) its actually creating sub threads for every single post he's making. To actually read his post and all future posts below it may cause unnecessary database overhead. (Maybe this is why the server is crashing lately?)



That said, a threaded discussion may only be applicable in tech forums and usenet but not in a community forum where some members tend to SPAM. *hint hint*



Newsgroup



Forum (there's a forum netiquette section about spamming and multiposting that some members should probably read =P )

[/quote]

Hello, have a look at the post count, it is now CE who is leading the way. I have no more stamina after the last few months.


[quote user="wolfx"]


Lowyat.net which is Malaysia's largest community forum, uses invision powerboard, one of the most highly acclaimed commercial PHP boards in the market. These are the board statistics as of 10:28pm today.



Quote



1656 user(s) active in the past 15 minutes
Our members have made a total of 3,758,955 posts
We have 104,749 registered members



And it has yet to break down. Only time its down is during scheduled maintenance.



Compared to our BGC:



Quote


There are 1 guest(s) online. There are 2 of 317 member(s) online - wolfx, jack208


317 users have contributed to 7,647 threads and 9,374 posts.

In the past 24 hours, we have 0 new thread(s), 76 new post(s), and 0 new user(s).


 


And still it breaks down so often, about twice a week. I rest my case. [:p]
[/quote]

Don't be so mean to Jeff lah,
if you think you can do better, you are welcome to try to improve on the design of this forum.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:00:58 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]To the rest of the guys: INCOMING!
Ooooops! Too late!
And I didn't even had time to put my flame-proof undies on.[hotsun]
[/quote]

*Opens door*
"Hi guys!"
*Looks at Chargrilled participants and and jack-o-lantern and a werewolf*
"Bye guys!"
*Slams door and runs*
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:01:49 am
[quote user="ayheng"]

i sense some post... [hijacked] [offtopic] !!!



dudes, get your techno-geek speak to non-gaming kopitiam discussion. Here is supposed to be my wallowing in self pity discussion about my script mistake [:(] [8o|] [headsmoke] [headcurse] [yinyang]

[/quote]

Well, if you wish, we could post the submission and go over the whole thing just to prolong your depression.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:02:28 am
[quote user="shrapnel"]

So ...mmm who's getting the most VPs here... Jack-O-lantern or Werewolfx?

[/quote]

Jack-O-Lantern: 3
Werewolfx: 2
Forum: -54
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 02, 2007, 11:03:43 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="jack208"]

CE: rhyen is right that a post that has been replied cannot be deleted (due to integrity links etc (technical jargon)). But you r also right admin can do anything... for eg I can force-delete that post... what happens is that it'll clear the profile of the poster. So can?



p/s Oh... when a profile is clear, you still retain your username so no worry but your post count gets reset to zero. [:P]

[/quote]

OOOOhhhh.......must take care not to offend the Jedi Council in the future at all......
So powerful the Jedi Council is.[machinegun]
[/quote]

Sarcasm? Or true fear?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:04:10 am
[quote user="macedwin"]wah, drive ferrari still can come last... no wonder fly aeroplane never arrive lor ;-)[/quote]

because Ferrari get stuck in traffic jam.
Aeroplane circling up there also cannot land because all the road all jam up.
He better take a helicopter next time.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 02, 2007, 11:05:34 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]To the rest of the guys: INCOMING!
Ooooops! Too late!
And I didn't even had time to put my flame-proof undies on.[hotsun]
[/quote]

*Opens door*
"Hi guys!"
*Looks at Chargrilled participants and and jack-o-lantern and a werewolf*
"Bye guys!"
*Slams door and runs*
[/quote]

Advice to Rhyen: Put on flameproof undies (male version, this time) before you open the door.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:06:46 am
[quote user="jack208"]

edited: btw where's the self-wallowing, hengy? Or mebbe we shud run another contest for BGC members to SPOT the error you made? If correct, you give them your Caylus PLE?? [:P]

[/quote]

[ohyeah] Hengy!
Say you will,
say you will give us your Caylus,
At least give us a chance to play with your prize Caylus.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:10:00 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]To the rest of the guys: INCOMING!
Ooooops! Too late!
And I didn't even had time to put my flame-proof undies on.[hotsun]
[/quote]

*Opens door*
"Hi guys!"
*Looks at Chargrilled participants and and jack-o-lantern and a werewolf*
"Bye guys!"
*Slams door and runs*
[/quote]

Advice to Rhyen: Put on flameproof undies (male version, this time) before you open the door.
[/quote]

Nah, the flame war already over, hence seeing all the chargrilled participants.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 02, 2007, 11:10:19 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="ayheng"]

i sense some post... [hijacked] [offtopic] !!!



dudes, get your techno-geek speak to non-gaming kopitiam discussion. Here is supposed to be my wallowing in self pity discussion about my script mistake [:(] [8o|] [headsmoke] [headcurse] [yinyang]

[/quote]

Well, if you wish, we could post the submission and go over the whole thing just to prolong your depression.
[/quote]

Hengy - since the competition submission deadline has passes, why don't you post your annotated game here, an we can collectively work on it?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:10:26 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"]

OOOOhhhh.......must take care not to offend the Jedi Council in the future at all......
So powerful the Jedi Council is.[machinegun]
[/quote]

Sarcasm? Or true fear?
[/quote]

True Fear, because I am not a programmer hence I cannot deconstruct the threat.
So, I will err on the side of caution.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 02, 2007, 11:11:38 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="ayheng"]

i sense some post... [hijacked] [offtopic] !!!



dudes, get your techno-geek speak to non-gaming kopitiam discussion. Here is supposed to be my wallowing in self pity discussion about my script mistake [:(] [8o|] [headsmoke] [headcurse] [yinyang]

[/quote]

Well, if you wish, we could post the submission and go over the whole thing just to prolong your depression.
[/quote]

Hengy - since the competition submission deadline has passes, why don't you post your annotated game here, an we can collectively work on it?
[/quote]

It is a very very very very long excel file.
I have a copy of it somewhere on my computer.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 02, 2007, 11:11:57 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="macedwin"]wah, drive ferrari still can come last... no wonder fly aeroplane never arrive lor ;-)[/quote]

because Ferrari get stuck in traffic jam.
Aeroplane circling up there also cannot land because all the road all jam up.
He better take a helicopter next time.
[/quote]

Worse - a Ferrari stcuk in a traffic jam is a dead Ferrari.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 02, 2007, 11:14:02 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]To the rest of the guys: INCOMING!
Ooooops! Too late!
And I didn't even had time to put my flame-proof undies on.[hotsun]
[/quote]

*Opens door*
"Hi guys!"
*Looks at Chargrilled participants and and jack-o-lantern and a werewolf*
"Bye guys!"
*Slams door and runs*
[/quote]

Advice to Rhyen: Put on flameproof undies (male version, this time) before you open the door.
[/quote]

Nah, the flame war already over, hence seeing all the chargrilled participants.
[/quote]

Man, have you seen Backdraft? Be careful when opening doors in a flaming building.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 02, 2007, 11:15:30 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"]

OOOOhhhh.......must take care not to offend the Jedi Council in the future at all......
So powerful the Jedi Council is.[machinegun]
[/quote]

Sarcasm? Or true fear?
[/quote]

True Fear, because I am not a programmer hence I cannot deconstruct the threat.
So, I will err on the side of caution.
[/quote]

Ahhh. So its Admin that's holding the MG, and not you.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 02, 2007, 04:36:29 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]

Hengy - since the competition submission deadline has passes, why don't you post your annotated game here, an we can collectively work on it?
[/quote]

as rhyen says, it's a long excel file, can't transcript it to the forum properly unless i do a rewrite, not something that i look forward to.

further more, there's nothing to fix as the error is a key foundation that collapses the whole structure. so, might as well start from scratch.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 02, 2007, 05:02:09 pm

[quote user="ayheng"]
further more, there's nothing to fix as the error is a key foundation that collapses the whole structure. so, might as well start from scratch.
[/quote]



Wanna tell us what's the key error then?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 02, 2007, 07:11:34 pm

[quote user="LoStBoYz"]
You sure its not some bad sectors in your RAM that's screwing with you?

BUT somehow you can delete it later. Whether its a bug or bad scripting, not too sure, me not coder.

Just for my knowledge, you still need to code forums? I thought the features already there in the package, you just need to script to get the look and feel you want. [/quote]



answers here.... [:)]
http://boardgamecafe.net/community/forums/thread/12457.aspx



 

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 04, 2007, 12:03:16 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]
Man, have you seen Backdraft? Be careful when opening doors in a flaming building.
[/quote]

That happens when a rush of air (carry lotsa oxygen) enters a room full of simmering embers, which creates an instance explosion, plus air circulation due to the influx of new air would send it right into your face. (Which was why I waited for 2 days before posting)
Go watch Discovery Channel
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 04, 2007, 12:03:51 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"]

OOOOhhhh.......must take care not to offend the Jedi Council in the future at all......
So powerful the Jedi Council is.[machinegun]
[/quote]

Sarcasm? Or true fear?
[/quote]

True Fear, because I am not a programmer hence I cannot deconstruct the threat.
So, I will err on the side of caution.
[/quote]

Ahhh. So its Admin that's holding the MG, and not you.
[/quote]

Well, I didn't want to post the Sith Lord photo just in case I get banned by Admin.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 04, 2007, 01:45:44 pm
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]
Man, have you seen Backdraft? Be careful when opening doors in a flaming building.
[/quote]

That happens when a rush of air (carry lotsa oxygen) enters a room full of simmering embers, which creates an instance explosion, plus air circulation due to the influx of new air would send it right into your face. (Which was why I waited for 2 days before posting)
Go watch Discovery Channel
[/quote]

Very wise...hope u wore an O2 mask.[;)]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 04, 2007, 01:47:42 pm
[quote user="rhyen"]
Well, I didn't want to post the Sith Lord photo just in case I get banned by Admin.
[/quote]

But the Admin isn't evil, neither is the Sith Lord. [A]
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 04, 2007, 01:53:44 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"]
Well, I didn't want to post the Sith Lord photo just in case I get banned by Admin.
[/quote]

But the Admin isn't evil, neither is the Sith Lord. [A]
[/quote]

oh right, one just happen to own this universe, the other was just on the dark side of that universe.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 05, 2007, 04:15:09 am
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="ayheng"]
further more, there's nothing to fix as the error is a key foundation that collapses the whole structure. so, might as well start from scratch.
[/quote]



Wanna tell us what's the key error then?



[/quote]



yes, i replaced the residence over another player's craft building. so the error is there. so in the end, i think some one that submits a regular script with no error will get the prize, not necessary will the person with the 'potential' for higher scoring will get it.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 09, 2007, 02:15:15 am
Red fox to Blue rabbit, red fox to blue rabbit, do you read me? i say do you read me? the box is opened, i repeat, the box is opened. intel suggest shrap-nel, ay-cee, wolf-x and rh-yen was there when security was breached. over and out.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 09, 2007, 02:45:39 am
We read you loud n clear, Red Fox. Will proceed with termination process to ensure those involved in security breach are erased. I repeat, full erasure. btw this means we can keep our copy mint? [ohyeah] Blue rabbit over and out.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 09, 2007, 03:10:28 am

[quote user="jack208"]We read you loud n clear, Red Fox. Will proceed with termination process to ensure those involved in security breach are erased. I repeat, full erasure. btw this means we can keep our copy mint? [ohyeah] Blue rabbit over and out.[/quote]



no, i repeat, no. advise to open to check component count. also to verify security code inside game with ystari.com [:P].

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 09, 2007, 09:45:46 am

"Red Fox, Red Fox, pls let us have your latest update... did rh-yen get his saliva on the board? over and out."





Red Fox: Like new, but with aliens fingerprints everywhere.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Mint.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 10, 2007, 02:12:15 pm
[quote user="ayheng"]

[quote user="jack208"]We read you loud n clear, Red Fox. Will proceed with termination process to ensure those involved in security breach are erased. I repeat, full erasure. btw this means we can keep our copy mint? [ohyeah] Blue rabbit over and out.[/quote]



no, i repeat, no. advise to open to check component count. also to verify security code inside game with ystari.com [:P].

[/quote]

Yellow eyes to Red Fox and Blue Rabbit, please be advised that interlopers have been terminated. I repeat, interlopers have been terminated. Please reseal containment unit. Over and out.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 11, 2007, 11:00:15 pm
Purple Panda to Red Fox. Copy that. Check the moth balls. Were they inserted? Over.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 12, 2007, 08:28:18 am

[quote user="Champion Eternal"]Purple Panda to Red Fox. Copy that. Check the moth balls. Were they inserted? Over.
[/quote]



Blue Rabbit to Red Fox. Pls dun overdo the moth balls otherwise we'll have an internal infestation to deal with. Over.





Latest Status
Red Fox:
Still considered new, but with aliens fingerprints everywhere and possible saliva patch. Tokens unpunched. King Philip fondled multipled times.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Mint.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 12, 2007, 10:27:00 am
Whose saliva?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 12, 2007, 01:35:00 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

"Red Fox, Red Fox, pls let us have your latest update... did rh-yen get his saliva on the board? over and out."





Red Fox: Like new, but with aliens fingerprints everywhere.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Mint.

[/quote]

Chill out! I drool over the table while holding the box and game high up over my head.
Apologies to Tracy for that mess.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 12, 2007, 01:35:13 pm
[quote user="Champion Eternal"]Whose saliva?
[/quote]

Mine! supposedly.....
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 12, 2007, 01:36:11 pm
[quote user="jack208"]

[quote user="Champion Eternal"]Purple Panda to Red Fox. Copy that. Check the moth balls. Were they inserted? Over.
[/quote]



Blue Rabbit to Red Fox. Pls dun overdo the moth balls otherwise we'll have an internal infestation to deal with. Over.





Latest Status
Red Fox:
Still considered new, but with aliens fingerprints everywhere and possible saliva patch. Tokens unpunched. King Philip fondled multipled times.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Mint.

[/quote]

Too late! Infestation already breeding inside, suspect alien fingerprints are actually spores of alien fungus!
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 12, 2007, 06:48:33 pm
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="jack208"]

"Red Fox, Red Fox, pls let us have your latest update... did rh-yen get his saliva on the board? over and out."





Red Fox: Like new, but with aliens fingerprints everywhere.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Mint.

[/quote]

Chill out! I drool over the table while holding the box and game high up over my head.
Apologies to Tracy for that mess.
[/quote]

How do you w*nk with no hands?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 12, 2007, 06:49:37 pm
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Whose saliva?
[/quote]

Mine! supposedly.....
[/quote]

If it glows in UV light, it is not saliva.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 13, 2007, 10:51:34 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="jack208"]

"Red Fox, Red Fox, pls let us have your latest update... did rh-yen get his saliva on the board? over and out."





Red Fox: Like new, but with aliens fingerprints everywhere.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Mint.

[/quote]

Chill out! I drool over the table while holding the box and game high up over my head.
Apologies to Tracy for that mess.
[/quote]

How do you w*nk with no hands?
[/quote]

ever heard of the term frottage?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 13, 2007, 10:51:56 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Whose saliva?
[/quote]

Mine! supposedly.....
[/quote]

If it glows in UV light, it is not saliva.
[/quote]

it definitely doesn't glow in the UV light, it glows in the sunlight.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 14, 2007, 12:46:05 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="jack208"]

"Red Fox, Red Fox, pls let us have your latest update... did rh-yen get his saliva on the board? over and out."





Red Fox: Like new, but with aliens fingerprints everywhere.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Mint.

[/quote]

Chill out! I drool over the table while holding the box and game high up over my head.
Apologies to Tracy for that mess.
[/quote]

How do you w*nk with no hands?
[/quote]

ever heard of the term frottage?
[/quote]

No, but there is no need to do a demonstration. The police might turn up.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 14, 2007, 12:47:06 am
[quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"][quote user="Champion Eternal"]Whose saliva?
[/quote]

Mine! supposedly.....
[/quote]

If it glows in UV light, it is not saliva.
[/quote]

it definitely doesn't glow in the UV light, it glows in the sunlight.
[/quote]

OK, then you did not say the A word while u held it up then.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 14, 2007, 11:58:22 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"]

ever heard of the term frottage?
[/quote]

No, but there is no need to do a demonstration. The police might turn up.
[/quote]

don't worry, we made pretty sure than Tracy and Ryan closed the shutters before we even opened the box. So, no worries about the law enforcement units.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 14, 2007, 11:59:54 am
[quote user="Champion Eternal"][quote user="rhyen"]

it definitely doesn't glow in the UV light, it glows in the sunlight.
[/quote]

OK, then you did not say the A word while u held it up then.
[/quote]

Okay, [hijacked] has gone on long enough.
Let's talk about something else.....can anyone get their hands of that display set of Caylus that we saw in the Essen pictures?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 23, 2007, 06:13:18 am

[:)]



Red Fox: "Like new", greenies started growing. Need weekly cleaning to remove greenies.
Blue Rabbit: Shrinkwrapped, Still Mint.

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on November 23, 2007, 09:57:02 am

Join the campaign! Put this as your signatures! Nowadays its all about freespeech after all. [:p]



(http://aycu12.webshots.com/image/33811/2004712972961546504_rs.jpg) (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2004712972961546504)

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 23, 2007, 12:49:05 pm
[quote user="wolfx"]

Join the campaign! Put this as your signatures! Nowadays its all about freespeech after all. [:p]



(http://aycu12.webshots.com/image/33811/2004712972961546504_rs.jpg) (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2004712972961546504)

[/quote]

viva la revolution!!! Do you hear the meeples sing?
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 24, 2007, 06:34:05 am
just updated my signature (how annoying can you get?)

for those interested, the code is here:

<a href="http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2004712972961546504" target="_blank" title="http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2004712972961546504"><img src="http://aycu12.webshots.com/image/33811/2004712972961546504_rs.jpg" border="0" /></a>

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on November 24, 2007, 10:52:52 am

Yay. I shall join the campaign to open Caylus PLE!



 

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 24, 2007, 11:15:51 am

[quote user="wolfx"]Yay. I shall join the campaign to open Caylus PLE![/quote]



what a pity u guys not in politics!! unfortunately tis no politics. Can a campaign make someone open up his priceless Caylus to be played/touched/fondled/molested in public?



Hmm.. I guess only ayheng can answer that question as he's halfway there oredi. [:P]

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 25, 2007, 07:09:38 am
Alright being free today, i opened my Caylus Premium Ed to admire the graphics and count the bits again and lo behold, 6 black worker bits are missing.

Better check your components, jack208.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on November 25, 2007, 10:26:23 am

[quote user="ayheng"]Alright being free today, i opened my Caylus Premium Ed to admire the graphics and count the bits again and lo behold, 6 black worker bits are missing.

Better check your components, jack208.
[/quote]



Ohhhh....means jeff will open his copy next weekend yea?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 25, 2007, 12:21:18 pm

ayheng, I think you bought the 4-player edition la. So actually it's not missing 6 black workers but you got extra 7 black discs and 20 black houses!!! Mebbe you can sell them to wolfx as souvenir for say rm235. At rm5/disc and rm10/house, it's really a good deal for him. [:P]



Next time when he plays his vanilla (read: boring) Caylus, he can use Black and then boast, "Hello, I'm using the Premium discs and houses muahahaha." LOL



Oh wolfx, mine opened, checked and even played liao!! The sound of the coins when you threw it back the bank pool after you placed a worker is UNBELIEVABLE!! Ka-ching ka-ching KA-CHING! [dance3]



btw wolfx, I smsed you asking whether you want to join us or not ma! You didn't get my SMS ar? Wey, you left your SMS Inbox full and didn't purge old messages ar? LOL

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: Champion Eternal on November 25, 2007, 03:29:08 pm
The workers - are they like the normal Caylus ones?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 25, 2007, 04:52:21 pm

[quote user="Champion Eternal"]The workers - are they like the normal Caylus ones?
[/quote]



No, they aren't. The vanilla Caylus workers are oblong. The Premium Caylus workers look like bowling pins. So if you play using the Premium Ed workers in a vanilla board, you can see the difference.



Here's a nice painted pic of King Phillip (from BGG). Psst [:-*] whoever offers to paint my King Phillip like in the pic below guarantees him(her)self a seat when we play my Caylus Premium Ed. hehe



...but it's the coins, man, da coins!!

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on November 26, 2007, 04:51:48 am
[quote user="jack208"]



btw wolfx, I smsed you asking whether you want to join us or not ma! You didn't get my SMS ar? Wey, you left your SMS Inbox full and didn't purge old messages ar? LOL



[/quote]



 



Dun bluff! My inbox was cleared and received no such SMS. [:p]



Who you supposedly played with? Beowulf? Odin? Loki?

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: rhyen on November 26, 2007, 12:35:45 pm
Enough with all this chest-thumping. Just set the date, time and venue and we will all come in plastic suits.
Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 26, 2007, 12:53:49 pm

[quote user="rhyen"]Enough with all this chest-thumping. Just set the date, time and venue and we will all come in plastic suits.
[/quote]



It'll need more than plastic suits, mate to earn a place to sit at the Table of 5. [:)] For starters, there's one seat for the King Phillip painter.... hehehe...



Next probably is my Space Hulk set. LOL



btw wolfx, how come you knew I played with Loki & gang? you been mixing with these guys too? kakaka....

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: ayheng on November 27, 2007, 12:00:58 pm
[quote user="ayheng"]just updated my signature (how annoying can you get?)

for those interested, the code is here:

<a href="http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2004712972961546504" target="_blank" title="http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2004712972961546504"><img src="http://aycu12.webshots.com/image/33811/2004712972961546504_rs.jpg" border="0" /></a>



[/quote]



alright, since jack208 had opened his set, this campaign is officially successful and over. (gah, bye bye annoying sig)

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: wolfx on November 27, 2007, 01:19:10 pm

Sure boh? Campaign not officially over until we PLAY his set. [;)]



PS: Is mr jeff coming to Selesa with Caylus PLE if he not going Brunei? Hmmm.



 

Title: Caylus Premium Ed - How high can you fly?
Post by: jack208 on November 27, 2007, 02:09:21 pm
[quote user="wolfx"]Sure boh? Campaign not officially over until we PLAY his set. [;)] PS: Is mr jeff coming to Selesa with Caylus PLE if he not going Brunei? Hmmm.[/quote]

If like that ar, you might as well start building a website for this campaign.. coz I dun think my set is gonna see any open play any time in the near future... tsk tsk.



And if I'm going to Selesa, you can bet I'll be bringing 1856 instead... hehehe [ohyeah]